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	<title>Comments on: Welcome to your genome</title>
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	<link>http://www.gnxp.com/new/2011/08/03/welcome-to-your-genome/</link>
	<description>Genetics</description>
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		<title>By: kjmtchl</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/new/2011/08/03/welcome-to-your-genome/#comment-2751</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[kjmtchl]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Aug 2011 18:36:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1378#comment-2751</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[TGGP, here&#039;s a comment I posted on the paper suggesting IQ is controlled by thousands of variants, on the new Gene Expression website.  Original post and all comments here: http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2011/08/half-the-variation-in-i-q-is-due-to-genes/comment-page-1/#comment-81624 

 I would interpret these findings very differently. What the authors do is analyse GWAS data in a very unusual way – they are not interested in finding specific SNPs affecting the trait, they simply use the SNPs to measure genetic relatedness between individuals. (Well, they were interested in findings specific SNPs but once they didn’t find any significant ones they turned to this other kind of analysis). Razib, you say that the people in the study are unrelated but they are not – they are all from the same population and are distantly related. The study uses SNPs across the genome to measure this relatedness and then shows it correlates with phenotypic similarity – i.e., the trait is heritable. We knew that already.

What they claim is that you can break down this effect by chromosome or by subregion. When they use the SNPs along longer chromosomes they seem to get a bigger effect – “explaining more of the phenotypic variance”. The inference is that thousands of SNPs, scattered across the whole genome, contribute to the trait or, more specifically to variance in the trait across the population (the implication is that they contribute to the value of the trait in individuals).
There is an alternative explanation for this effect, however, which is that using more SNPs simply gives a better estimate of genetic relatedness. So, the SNPs on chromosomes 1 (the longest) give a better estimate than those on chromosome 21 (the shortest) – they index relatedness with more precision. As a result, they correlate better with phenotypic similarity – this looks like you have “explained more of the variance”. In fact, getting such a signal from SNPs on chromosome 1 does not mean that any of the causal variants are actually on chromosome 1. Nor does the fact that such signals can be derived from anywhere in the genome mean that there are thousands of variants across the genome affecting the trait.
In fact, the authors can conclude very little from this study beyond a replication of the known fact that IQ is heritable. 

They can say nothing about how many variants are involved across the population or how many affect the trait in each individual. Note that those could be very very different from each other – you could have hundreds or thousands of genes affecting a trait across the population, but only one, two or a handful of variants affecting the phenotype in any individual. Nor can they say whether the causal variants are common or rare. One could expect different combinations of small numbers of different rare variants to be determining phenotype in different individuals. In fact, I would say that is exactly what one should expect. Not the picture they try to sell in this paper, which is that the phenotype in any individual is determined by the combination of thousands of common variants.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>TGGP, here&#8217;s a comment I posted on the paper suggesting IQ is controlled by thousands of variants, on the new Gene Expression website.  Original post and all comments here: <a href="http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2011/08/half-the-variation-in-i-q-is-due-to-genes/comment-page-1/#comment-81624" rel="nofollow">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2011/08/half-the-variation-in-i-q-is-due-to-genes/comment-page-1/#comment-81624</a> </p>
<p> I would interpret these findings very differently. What the authors do is analyse GWAS data in a very unusual way – they are not interested in finding specific SNPs affecting the trait, they simply use the SNPs to measure genetic relatedness between individuals. (Well, they were interested in findings specific SNPs but once they didn’t find any significant ones they turned to this other kind of analysis). Razib, you say that the people in the study are unrelated but they are not – they are all from the same population and are distantly related. The study uses SNPs across the genome to measure this relatedness and then shows it correlates with phenotypic similarity – i.e., the trait is heritable. We knew that already.</p>
<p>What they claim is that you can break down this effect by chromosome or by subregion. When they use the SNPs along longer chromosomes they seem to get a bigger effect – “explaining more of the phenotypic variance”. The inference is that thousands of SNPs, scattered across the whole genome, contribute to the trait or, more specifically to variance in the trait across the population (the implication is that they contribute to the value of the trait in individuals).<br />
There is an alternative explanation for this effect, however, which is that using more SNPs simply gives a better estimate of genetic relatedness. So, the SNPs on chromosomes 1 (the longest) give a better estimate than those on chromosome 21 (the shortest) – they index relatedness with more precision. As a result, they correlate better with phenotypic similarity – this looks like you have “explained more of the variance”. In fact, getting such a signal from SNPs on chromosome 1 does not mean that any of the causal variants are actually on chromosome 1. Nor does the fact that such signals can be derived from anywhere in the genome mean that there are thousands of variants across the genome affecting the trait.<br />
In fact, the authors can conclude very little from this study beyond a replication of the known fact that IQ is heritable. </p>
<p>They can say nothing about how many variants are involved across the population or how many affect the trait in each individual. Note that those could be very very different from each other – you could have hundreds or thousands of genes affecting a trait across the population, but only one, two or a handful of variants affecting the phenotype in any individual. Nor can they say whether the causal variants are common or rare. One could expect different combinations of small numbers of different rare variants to be determining phenotype in different individuals. In fact, I would say that is exactly what one should expect. Not the picture they try to sell in this paper, which is that the phenotype in any individual is determined by the combination of thousands of common variants.</p>
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		<title>By: Intelligence &#8211; heritable, yes; polygenic, maybe &#171; Entitled to an Opinion</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/new/2011/08/03/welcome-to-your-genome/#comment-2750</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Intelligence &#8211; heritable, yes; polygenic, maybe &#171; Entitled to an Opinion]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Aug 2011 01:52:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1378#comment-2750</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] to it) distributed trait like height. When I first mention it to Kevin Mitchell at GNXP classic he dissented, saying they failed to establish the polygenic nature of the trait. He has yet to make a post of [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] to it) distributed trait like height. When I first mention it to Kevin Mitchell at GNXP classic he dissented, saying they failed to establish the polygenic nature of the trait. He has yet to make a post of [...]</p>
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		<title>By: TGGP</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/new/2011/08/03/welcome-to-your-genome/#comment-2747</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[TGGP]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 14:10:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1378#comment-2747</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;m really not competent to evaluate it, but I thought this was showing similar results as the earlier height study (hat-tip to &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.overcomingbias.com/2010/07/brave-position-club.html#comment-452198&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Jason Malloy&lt;/a&gt;).]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m really not competent to evaluate it, but I thought this was showing similar results as the earlier height study (hat-tip to <a href="http://www.overcomingbias.com/2010/07/brave-position-club.html#comment-452198" rel="nofollow">Jason Malloy</a>).</p>
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		<title>By: kjmtchl</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/new/2011/08/03/welcome-to-your-genome/#comment-2743</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[kjmtchl]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Aug 2011 13:36:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1378#comment-2743</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Ha!  Well, I saw that paper (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21826061) and have read it and am trying to make sense of it.  Seems like they have conclusively proved that intelligence is heritable.  And nothing more.  Of course we knew that already.   I do not think their other conclusion - that it is massively polygenic - is supported by their analyses, but I&#039;ve spent a good part of the last couple days trying to figure out exactly what they did and see if I am mistaken.  What did you think of it?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ha!  Well, I saw that paper (<a href="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21826061" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21826061</a>) and have read it and am trying to make sense of it.  Seems like they have conclusively proved that intelligence is heritable.  And nothing more.  Of course we knew that already.   I do not think their other conclusion &#8211; that it is massively polygenic &#8211; is supported by their analyses, but I&#8217;ve spent a good part of the last couple days trying to figure out exactly what they did and see if I am mistaken.  What did you think of it?</p>
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		<title>By: TGGP</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/new/2011/08/03/welcome-to-your-genome/#comment-2742</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[TGGP]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Aug 2011 13:20:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1378#comment-2742</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[What is the world coming to when &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.halfsigma.com/2011/08/progress-on-the-genetics-of-intelligence.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Half Sigma&lt;/a&gt; is earlier to reporting on a gene/IQ story than GNXP.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What is the world coming to when <a href="http://www.halfsigma.com/2011/08/progress-on-the-genetics-of-intelligence.html" rel="nofollow">Half Sigma</a> is earlier to reporting on a gene/IQ story than GNXP.</p>
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		<title>By: Henry Harpending</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/new/2011/08/03/welcome-to-your-genome/#comment-2741</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Henry Harpending]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Aug 2011 12:56:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1378#comment-2741</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Sorry to be obscure, I just mean under neutrality.  Standard coalescent theory predicts that the number of loci with i copies of a mutant will be proportional to 1/i.  So the number of loci with 1, 2, and 3 copies of a mutant should be in the ratio of 1 to 1/2 to 1/3, etc.

I don&#039;t know where I dug out that 1/2 in my note above: senescence perhaps.

Henry]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry to be obscure, I just mean under neutrality.  Standard coalescent theory predicts that the number of loci with i copies of a mutant will be proportional to 1/i.  So the number of loci with 1, 2, and 3 copies of a mutant should be in the ratio of 1 to 1/2 to 1/3, etc.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know where I dug out that 1/2 in my note above: senescence perhaps.</p>
<p>Henry</p>
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		<title>By: kjmtchl</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/new/2011/08/03/welcome-to-your-genome/#comment-2740</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[kjmtchl]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Aug 2011 08:04:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1378#comment-2740</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Henry, I am not sure what your mean by a very large &quot;neutral&quot; population - could you explain please?  (And yes, it&#039;s no surprise that rare variants are population-specific and also more responsible for disease, although there is still quite some resistance to the idea among many medical geneticists who have been pursuing genome-wide association studies).]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Henry, I am not sure what your mean by a very large &#8220;neutral&#8221; population &#8211; could you explain please?  (And yes, it&#8217;s no surprise that rare variants are population-specific and also more responsible for disease, although there is still quite some resistance to the idea among many medical geneticists who have been pursuing genome-wide association studies).</p>
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		<title>By: Henry Harpending</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/new/2011/08/03/welcome-to-your-genome/#comment-2739</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Henry Harpending]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Aug 2011 19:08:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1378#comment-2739</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Nice writeup but perhaps no surprise.  In a textbook very large neutral population of constant size half the mutants should be singletons, right?

Henry Harpending]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice writeup but perhaps no surprise.  In a textbook very large neutral population of constant size half the mutants should be singletons, right?</p>
<p>Henry Harpending</p>
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		<title>By: expeedee</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/new/2011/08/03/welcome-to-your-genome/#comment-2737</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[expeedee]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Aug 2011 18:39:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1378#comment-2737</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thanks you so much for a fascinating article, which is well written and clear.  Please keep us up to date on this interesting research.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks you so much for a fascinating article, which is well written and clear.  Please keep us up to date on this interesting research.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: kjmtchl</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/new/2011/08/03/welcome-to-your-genome/#comment-2736</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[kjmtchl]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Aug 2011 07:37:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1378#comment-2736</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thanks Dave for your kind comments. You might be interested in an excellent commentary by David Goldstein in yesterday&#039;s Nature, on the implications for prenatal screening.

http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v476/n7358/full/476027a.html

Kevin.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Dave for your kind comments. You might be interested in an excellent commentary by David Goldstein in yesterday&#8217;s Nature, on the implications for prenatal screening.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v476/n7358/full/476027a.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v476/n7358/full/476027a.html</a></p>
<p>Kevin.</p>
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		<title>By: dave chamberlin</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/new/2011/08/03/welcome-to-your-genome/#comment-2734</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dave chamberlin]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Aug 2011 21:21:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1378#comment-2734</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[My compliments to the writer of this piece, you have done a fine job of explaining genome diversity and I now understand it in a new light. Excellent science writing and I encourage you to expand this brief piece as more becomes known.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My compliments to the writer of this piece, you have done a fine job of explaining genome diversity and I now understand it in a new light. Excellent science writing and I encourage you to expand this brief piece as more becomes known.</p>
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