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	<title>Comments for Gene Expression</title>
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	<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp</link>
	<description>Genetics</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 14 May 2012 17:38:25 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on De novo mutations in autism by ab</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/04/04/de-novo-mutations-in-autism/#comment-2922</link>
		<dc:creator>ab</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 May 2012 17:38:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1469#comment-2922</guid>
		<description>The most interesting aspect of this research to me as a practitioner, is that there is a general increase in genetic degradations that can not be attributed to hereditary, per se.  From a historical perspective and from what I see in classroom and therapeutic settings, there a general decline in the neurological systems of the children that we are producing--leading to a broad spectrum of disorders that include learning disabilities, sensory-processing disorders, attention deficit disorders, autism, Asberger Syndrome and psychiatric disorders.  Most have co-morbid symptoms or factors and can include deficits in the functions of organ systems throughout the body.   De novo mutations are the most likely cause of this spectrum of neurological deficits.  Rosko&#039;s comment about regarding the organism as an ecosystem is on point.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The most interesting aspect of this research to me as a practitioner, is that there is a general increase in genetic degradations that can not be attributed to hereditary, per se.  From a historical perspective and from what I see in classroom and therapeutic settings, there a general decline in the neurological systems of the children that we are producing&#8211;leading to a broad spectrum of disorders that include learning disabilities, sensory-processing disorders, attention deficit disorders, autism, Asberger Syndrome and psychiatric disorders.  Most have co-morbid symptoms or factors and can include deficits in the functions of organ systems throughout the body.   De novo mutations are the most likely cause of this spectrum of neurological deficits.  Rosko&#8217;s comment about regarding the organism as an ecosystem is on point.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Robustness and fragility in neural development by DR01D</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/04/27/robustness-and-fragility-in-neural-development/#comment-2921</link>
		<dc:creator>DR01D</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 May 2012 13:57:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1471#comment-2921</guid>
		<description>Maternal Antibodies to Gluten Linked to Schizophrenia Risk in Children
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/05/120510113519.htm

&quot;Lifestyle and genes are not the only factors that shape disease risk, and factors and exposures before, during and after birth can help pre-program much of our adult health,&quot; said investigator Robert Yolken, M.D., a neuro-virologist at Johns Hopkins Children&#039;s Center.  

Maternal infections and other inflammatory disorders during pregnancy have long been linked to greater risk for schizophrenia in the offspring but, the Swedish and U.S. investigators say, this is the first study that points to maternal food sensitivity as a possible culprit in the development of such disorders.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maternal Antibodies to Gluten Linked to Schizophrenia Risk in Children<br />
<a href="http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/05/120510113519.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/05/120510113519.htm</a></p>
<p>&#8220;Lifestyle and genes are not the only factors that shape disease risk, and factors and exposures before, during and after birth can help pre-program much of our adult health,&#8221; said investigator Robert Yolken, M.D., a neuro-virologist at Johns Hopkins Children&#8217;s Center.  </p>
<p>Maternal infections and other inflammatory disorders during pregnancy have long been linked to greater risk for schizophrenia in the offspring but, the Swedish and U.S. investigators say, this is the first study that points to maternal food sensitivity as a possible culprit in the development of such disorders.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Looking for a few good 145+ I.Q. individuals by Chandler</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2011/08/19/looking-for-a-few-good-145-i-q-individuals/#comment-2920</link>
		<dc:creator>Chandler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 May 2012 18:38:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1387#comment-2920</guid>
		<description>I hope it&#039;s not too late to help. My IQ is 152, if that&#039;s up there enough, but I&#039;m only 15. You said you need adults, either way I&#039;m glad to help. Another thing; I have HFA, if that&#039;d be a problem.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I hope it&#8217;s not too late to help. My IQ is 152, if that&#8217;s up there enough, but I&#8217;m only 15. You said you need adults, either way I&#8217;m glad to help. Another thing; I have HFA, if that&#8217;d be a problem.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Robustness and fragility in neural development by DR01D</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/04/27/robustness-and-fragility-in-neural-development/#comment-2919</link>
		<dc:creator>DR01D</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 May 2012 14:28:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1471#comment-2919</guid>
		<description>&quot; ...if neurodevelopmental systems are so robust, then why do we ever get neurodevelopmental disease?&quot;

Two words: environmental damage</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8221; &#8230;if neurodevelopmental systems are so robust, then why do we ever get neurodevelopmental disease?&#8221;</p>
<p>Two words: environmental damage</p>
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		<title>Comment on Robustness and fragility in neural development by kjmtchl</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/04/27/robustness-and-fragility-in-neural-development/#comment-2918</link>
		<dc:creator>kjmtchl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Apr 2012 18:13:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1471#comment-2918</guid>
		<description>Thanks for that.  That is exactly what I think is the major mode of robustness here - distributed robustness of the system as opposed to redundancy of parts.  Thanks for the refs. Kevin</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for that.  That is exactly what I think is the major mode of robustness here &#8211; distributed robustness of the system as opposed to redundancy of parts.  Thanks for the refs. Kevin</p>
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		<title>Comment on I&#8217;ve got your missing heritability right here&#8230; by Priceeqn1</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/02/07/ive-got-your-missing-heritability-right-here/#comment-2917</link>
		<dc:creator>Priceeqn1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Apr 2012 04:44:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1447#comment-2917</guid>
		<description>S.V. Nuzhdin and his collaborators have come up with an interesting way of making genotype-to-phenotype maps using structural equation models. It seems like a reasonable way to go beyond GWAS and actually start to pinpoint the exact genes and regulatory regions that work with our environment to determine phenotype.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>S.V. Nuzhdin and his collaborators have come up with an interesting way of making genotype-to-phenotype maps using structural equation models. It seems like a reasonable way to go beyond GWAS and actually start to pinpoint the exact genes and regulatory regions that work with our environment to determine phenotype.</p>
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		<title>Comment on I&#8217;ve got your missing heritability right here&#8230; by Priceeqn1</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/02/07/ive-got-your-missing-heritability-right-here/#comment-2916</link>
		<dc:creator>Priceeqn1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Apr 2012 04:42:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1447#comment-2916</guid>
		<description>This is quite interesting. I see that the Zuk et al paper chose not to model fitness as additive. That is fascinating! I teach Labs for a graduate course on population genetics. We are very careful to mention repeatedly in class when going over the various models that models assuming additivity are but one type of model, and there may yet be others that make more sense that don&#039;t assume additivity. Jon Seger, working in whale lice, has found that weakly deleterious mutations might account for a vast amount of the so-called &quot;missing&quot; heritability. It&#039;s just so small we won&#039;t find it very easy. Lately he&#039;s come up with some interesting toy models to figure out how we could see signals of these purported common alleles that should have an (almost!) immeasurably small effect on fitness.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is quite interesting. I see that the Zuk et al paper chose not to model fitness as additive. That is fascinating! I teach Labs for a graduate course on population genetics. We are very careful to mention repeatedly in class when going over the various models that models assuming additivity are but one type of model, and there may yet be others that make more sense that don&#8217;t assume additivity. Jon Seger, working in whale lice, has found that weakly deleterious mutations might account for a vast amount of the so-called &#8220;missing&#8221; heritability. It&#8217;s just so small we won&#8217;t find it very easy. Lately he&#8217;s come up with some interesting toy models to figure out how we could see signals of these purported common alleles that should have an (almost!) immeasurably small effect on fitness.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Robustness and fragility in neural development by Wintz</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/04/27/robustness-and-fragility-in-neural-development/#comment-2915</link>
		<dc:creator>Wintz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Apr 2012 22:22:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1471#comment-2915</guid>
		<description>Great post Kevin. A related area to Robustness, especially in the context of Complex Adaptive Systems, is found in the concept of &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Degeneracy_(biology)&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Degeneracy&lt;/a&gt;: circumstances where structurally dissimilar components/modules/pathways can perform similar functions (i.e. are effectively interchangeable) under certain conditions, but perform distinct functions in other conditions. 

See: 

(1) Whitacre, J.M. and A. Bender, Degeneracy: a design principle for achieving robustness and evolvability. Journal of Theoretical Biology, 2010. 263(1): p. 143-53.

(2) Mason, P.H., Degeneracy at Multiple Levels of Complexity. Biological Theory, 2010. 5(3): p. 277-288.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post Kevin. A related area to Robustness, especially in the context of Complex Adaptive Systems, is found in the concept of <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Degeneracy_(biology)" rel="nofollow">Degeneracy</a>: circumstances where structurally dissimilar components/modules/pathways can perform similar functions (i.e. are effectively interchangeable) under certain conditions, but perform distinct functions in other conditions. </p>
<p>See: </p>
<p>(1) Whitacre, J.M. and A. Bender, Degeneracy: a design principle for achieving robustness and evolvability. Journal of Theoretical Biology, 2010. 263(1): p. 143-53.</p>
<p>(2) Mason, P.H., Degeneracy at Multiple Levels of Complexity. Biological Theory, 2010. 5(3): p. 277-288.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Robustness and fragility in neural development by kjmtchl</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/04/27/robustness-and-fragility-in-neural-development/#comment-2914</link>
		<dc:creator>kjmtchl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Apr 2012 17:03:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1471#comment-2914</guid>
		<description>Sorry, links got lost somehow!  See annotated post here: http://wiringthebrain.blogspot.com/2012/04/robustness-and-fragility-in-neural.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry, links got lost somehow!  See annotated post here: <a href="http://wiringthebrain.blogspot.com/2012/04/robustness-and-fragility-in-neural.html" rel="nofollow">http://wiringthebrain.blogspot.com/2012/04/robustness-and-fragility-in-neural.html</a></p>
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		<title>Comment on I&#8217;ve got your missing heritability right here&#8230; by M. Simon</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/02/07/ive-got-your-missing-heritability-right-here/#comment-2912</link>
		<dc:creator>M. Simon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Apr 2012 10:00:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1447#comment-2912</guid>
		<description>kjmtchl,

From what I have seen re: PTSD studies and twin data, heritability is given as 50%. But that is not in fact the case. We know from general population genetic studies that about 20% of a population is susceptible to PTSD and yet only 1/2 those are affected.

OTOH in high stress war zones reports of the % of troops affected runs in the 20 to 25% range. About what you would expect if 100% of the susceptible get enough stress.

Twin studies do not in fact control for environment. As far as I can tell. 

I&#039;m sure it can be done (or done better), but that is currently not the case. IMO. I only know this because the study of PTSD is a hobby of mine. So I&#039;m not deeply conversant with the general field of genetics and heritability.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>kjmtchl,</p>
<p>From what I have seen re: PTSD studies and twin data, heritability is given as 50%. But that is not in fact the case. We know from general population genetic studies that about 20% of a population is susceptible to PTSD and yet only 1/2 those are affected.</p>
<p>OTOH in high stress war zones reports of the % of troops affected runs in the 20 to 25% range. About what you would expect if 100% of the susceptible get enough stress.</p>
<p>Twin studies do not in fact control for environment. As far as I can tell. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m sure it can be done (or done better), but that is currently not the case. IMO. I only know this because the study of PTSD is a hobby of mine. So I&#8217;m not deeply conversant with the general field of genetics and heritability.</p>
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		<title>Comment on De novo mutations in autism by kjmtchl</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/04/04/de-novo-mutations-in-autism/#comment-2910</link>
		<dc:creator>kjmtchl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Apr 2012 07:19:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1469#comment-2910</guid>
		<description>Rosko, you hit on a really interesting and, I think, crucial question.  If mutations in so many different genes can result in autism (or schizophrenia or epilepsy), then the question shifts to why those particular phenotypes emerge.  This is not just down to a general degradation of brain systems nor to the specific primary effects of each mutation on any particular brain system.  It is a property of the system itself, that when disturbed in various ways, it tends to gravitate towards particular pathophysiological states.  What the chain of events is that leads from any specific mutation to the eventual phenotype is not clear (though it can be investigated directly in animal models).  What is clear is that, for the vast majority of cases, we will not be able to predict the phenotype accurately even from full genome sequences, given that even monozygotic twins show a wide range of phenotypic expression.  This is a neurodevelopmental question - you cannot relate genotype to phenotype directly.  The genotype is expressed through the processes of development - these may channel the system into particular states (typically functioning in most cases, but specific pathologic states in others).  And these processes are intrinsically noisy, contributing substantially to phenotypic variance.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rosko, you hit on a really interesting and, I think, crucial question.  If mutations in so many different genes can result in autism (or schizophrenia or epilepsy), then the question shifts to why those particular phenotypes emerge.  This is not just down to a general degradation of brain systems nor to the specific primary effects of each mutation on any particular brain system.  It is a property of the system itself, that when disturbed in various ways, it tends to gravitate towards particular pathophysiological states.  What the chain of events is that leads from any specific mutation to the eventual phenotype is not clear (though it can be investigated directly in animal models).  What is clear is that, for the vast majority of cases, we will not be able to predict the phenotype accurately even from full genome sequences, given that even monozygotic twins show a wide range of phenotypic expression.  This is a neurodevelopmental question &#8211; you cannot relate genotype to phenotype directly.  The genotype is expressed through the processes of development &#8211; these may channel the system into particular states (typically functioning in most cases, but specific pathologic states in others).  And these processes are intrinsically noisy, contributing substantially to phenotypic variance.</p>
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		<title>Comment on De novo mutations in autism by rosko</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/04/04/de-novo-mutations-in-autism/#comment-2909</link>
		<dc:creator>rosko</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Apr 2012 02:31:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1469#comment-2909</guid>
		<description>@ Mark Houston: 
I think you are seeking a different kind of &quot;why&quot; than the majority of the people who do these genetic studies. 

If there are cases where a rare mutation in a gene occurs along with a phenotype of autism (or schizophrenia, or ADHD) multiple times, then it doesn&#039;t seem that far off to conjecture that this mutation was necessary for the phenotype, in those individuals. Whether it&#039;s sufficient is up for debate--that may be where environmental effects come in.

This is all a very phenomenological type of &quot;why&quot;--when piece X breaks, phenotype Y can result. This single-gene causality sheds little light, however, on why it makes sense that the system breaks in certain characteristic ways rather than others. This is even more true when it is seen that the same mutations can show up in multiple different disorders. While it may be a small step to suggest that had gene X not mutated, uncommon phenotype Y would probably be absent, a model that can robustly predict whether phenotype Y or Z occurs based solely on knowledge of a few mutations X1, X2, etc. is much more difficult. Even more so, if you try to predict the manifestation of a spectrum disorder, i.e. whether the autism will involve speech difficulty or hyperlexia, for instance--and these are the things that really have meaning for what special accommodations or interventions are necessary.

Things like growth patterns and resource trade-offs are much more likely to capture the failure modes as a whole. Biological systems clearly seem to malfunction in a very different way from human machines. If a brake fluid line is ruptured in a car, it will not cause the steering to become more accurate. The most adaptive we can get with designs is to incorporate redundancy, which delays the consequences of progressive malfunction. Probably the most fascinating characteristic of biological systems, in my opinion, is their ability to &quot;get by with what they have&quot;. Yes, there are things like congenital blindness and deafness where there is simple absence of a trait, but more often there are both extreme losses of function and gains of function in the same disorder. 

It is probably more apt to think of an organism like an ecosystem where loss of one species causes die-offs of some species and overgrowths of others. True understanding of biological phenotypes will only come about by understanding the interconnectedness of this &quot;ecosystem&quot;, which is much farther off than &quot;lacking X correlates with end result Y&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Mark Houston:<br />
I think you are seeking a different kind of &#8220;why&#8221; than the majority of the people who do these genetic studies. </p>
<p>If there are cases where a rare mutation in a gene occurs along with a phenotype of autism (or schizophrenia, or ADHD) multiple times, then it doesn&#8217;t seem that far off to conjecture that this mutation was necessary for the phenotype, in those individuals. Whether it&#8217;s sufficient is up for debate&#8211;that may be where environmental effects come in.</p>
<p>This is all a very phenomenological type of &#8220;why&#8221;&#8211;when piece X breaks, phenotype Y can result. This single-gene causality sheds little light, however, on why it makes sense that the system breaks in certain characteristic ways rather than others. This is even more true when it is seen that the same mutations can show up in multiple different disorders. While it may be a small step to suggest that had gene X not mutated, uncommon phenotype Y would probably be absent, a model that can robustly predict whether phenotype Y or Z occurs based solely on knowledge of a few mutations X1, X2, etc. is much more difficult. Even more so, if you try to predict the manifestation of a spectrum disorder, i.e. whether the autism will involve speech difficulty or hyperlexia, for instance&#8211;and these are the things that really have meaning for what special accommodations or interventions are necessary.</p>
<p>Things like growth patterns and resource trade-offs are much more likely to capture the failure modes as a whole. Biological systems clearly seem to malfunction in a very different way from human machines. If a brake fluid line is ruptured in a car, it will not cause the steering to become more accurate. The most adaptive we can get with designs is to incorporate redundancy, which delays the consequences of progressive malfunction. Probably the most fascinating characteristic of biological systems, in my opinion, is their ability to &#8220;get by with what they have&#8221;. Yes, there are things like congenital blindness and deafness where there is simple absence of a trait, but more often there are both extreme losses of function and gains of function in the same disorder. </p>
<p>It is probably more apt to think of an organism like an ecosystem where loss of one species causes die-offs of some species and overgrowths of others. True understanding of biological phenotypes will only come about by understanding the interconnectedness of this &#8220;ecosystem&#8221;, which is much farther off than &#8220;lacking X correlates with end result Y&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>Comment on I&#8217;ve got your missing heritability right here&#8230; by kjmtchl</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/02/07/ive-got-your-missing-heritability-right-here/#comment-2908</link>
		<dc:creator>kjmtchl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Apr 2012 10:57:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1447#comment-2908</guid>
		<description>It is certainly quite plausible that some mutations may increase risk to environmental triggers or that their effects may be modified by environmental factors (or vice versa).  Many disorders, especially neurodevelopmental ones, may even be directly phenocopied by environmental insults.  However, in terms of accounting for the missing heritability, these are not likely to be important, as they should not contribute to the measure of heritability - they should either be controlled for in twin studies or contribute to the non-genetic sources of variance.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is certainly quite plausible that some mutations may increase risk to environmental triggers or that their effects may be modified by environmental factors (or vice versa).  Many disorders, especially neurodevelopmental ones, may even be directly phenocopied by environmental insults.  However, in terms of accounting for the missing heritability, these are not likely to be important, as they should not contribute to the measure of heritability &#8211; they should either be controlled for in twin studies or contribute to the non-genetic sources of variance.</p>
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		<title>Comment on I&#8217;ve got your missing heritability right here&#8230; by M. Simon</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/02/07/ive-got-your-missing-heritability-right-here/#comment-2907</link>
		<dc:creator>M. Simon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Apr 2012 14:55:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1447#comment-2907</guid>
		<description>I have skimmed the comments (I may have missed something), but what if a trait only manifests when given certain environmental triggers (we know that is true for PTSD - it is in the name)? If a certain population has a gene and yet only 1/2 get the trigger then right away heritability is down to 50%.  

Is that really the right way to look at all this? 

Some have noted that all the complexities of genetic interactions have not yet been teased out. Throw in the environment and there are a LOT more threads to untangle.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have skimmed the comments (I may have missed something), but what if a trait only manifests when given certain environmental triggers (we know that is true for PTSD &#8211; it is in the name)? If a certain population has a gene and yet only 1/2 get the trigger then right away heritability is down to 50%.  </p>
<p>Is that really the right way to look at all this? </p>
<p>Some have noted that all the complexities of genetic interactions have not yet been teased out. Throw in the environment and there are a LOT more threads to untangle.</p>
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		<title>Comment on De novo mutations in autism by kjmtchl</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/04/04/de-novo-mutations-in-autism/#comment-2906</link>
		<dc:creator>kjmtchl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Apr 2012 07:46:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1469#comment-2906</guid>
		<description>I also don&#039;t find associations with increased risk in the range of 10% very convincing (e.g., expressed as natural frequencies, from an average population risk of say 1% to an increased risk of 1.1%).  Many GWAS results are actually less than that, which is why it is very hard to interpret what they mean in an individual.  In contrast, the risks associated with mutations in genes like FMR1, MeCP2, PTEN and many many others now identified are huge - ten, twenty, thirty-fold.  Any of these mutations is thankfully rare, but that does not bear on the magnitude of the effect in the individuals who carry them.  It just means we have a long way still to go to account for all or even a majority of cases.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I also don&#8217;t find associations with increased risk in the range of 10% very convincing (e.g., expressed as natural frequencies, from an average population risk of say 1% to an increased risk of 1.1%).  Many GWAS results are actually less than that, which is why it is very hard to interpret what they mean in an individual.  In contrast, the risks associated with mutations in genes like FMR1, MeCP2, PTEN and many many others now identified are huge &#8211; ten, twenty, thirty-fold.  Any of these mutations is thankfully rare, but that does not bear on the magnitude of the effect in the individuals who carry them.  It just means we have a long way still to go to account for all or even a majority of cases.</p>
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		<title>Comment on De novo mutations in autism by DR01D</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/04/04/de-novo-mutations-in-autism/#comment-2905</link>
		<dc:creator>DR01D</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Apr 2012 14:40:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1469#comment-2905</guid>
		<description>kjmtchl

Maybe that didn&#039;t come out quite right.  I didn&#039;t mean that you were overselling a particular finding. I mean that EVERYONE oversells these findings.  If tomorrow scientists discover that a gene raises the risk of Disease X by 10% the headline the next day will be &quot;Scientists Find Gene That Causes Disease X&quot;.  It&#039;s easy to become cynical.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>kjmtchl</p>
<p>Maybe that didn&#8217;t come out quite right.  I didn&#8217;t mean that you were overselling a particular finding. I mean that EVERYONE oversells these findings.  If tomorrow scientists discover that a gene raises the risk of Disease X by 10% the headline the next day will be &#8220;Scientists Find Gene That Causes Disease X&#8221;.  It&#8217;s easy to become cynical.</p>
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		<title>Comment on De novo mutations in autism by kjmtchl</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/04/04/de-novo-mutations-in-autism/#comment-2904</link>
		<dc:creator>kjmtchl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Apr 2012 14:30:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1469#comment-2904</guid>
		<description>Well, you&#039;re right, I overstated the case with respect to these specific discoveries, though the fact that NTNG1 mutations have previously been found (multiple independent times) in Rett syndrome makes that finding pretty strong.  The others look strong from these three papers but time will tell.  More generally, we already know of over a hundred separate genetic conditions caused by mutations in either single genes or by copy number variants that can cause autism (see, for example: Etiological heterogeneity in autism spectrum disorders: more than 100 genetic and genomic disorders and still counting. Betancur C. Brain Res. 2011 Mar 22;1380:42-77).  They do not always result in the symptoms of autism (as in Fragile X syndrome for example, where autistic symptoms are common but not universal), but, in the cases where the individual does have autism, the evidence that the specific mutation is causing those symptoms is extremely strong (i.e., the most reasonable and probable inference is that if they did not have the mutation they would not have autism).   

In contrast, previous associations with common SNPs, which supposedly contribute only a tiny increase in risk alone but a large effect in aggregate, have not held up over time.  In my opinion, that is because that model of the genetic architecture of illness is not correct - that does not imply (at all) that the illness is not primarily genetic.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, you&#8217;re right, I overstated the case with respect to these specific discoveries, though the fact that NTNG1 mutations have previously been found (multiple independent times) in Rett syndrome makes that finding pretty strong.  The others look strong from these three papers but time will tell.  More generally, we already know of over a hundred separate genetic conditions caused by mutations in either single genes or by copy number variants that can cause autism (see, for example: Etiological heterogeneity in autism spectrum disorders: more than 100 genetic and genomic disorders and still counting. Betancur C. Brain Res. 2011 Mar 22;1380:42-77).  They do not always result in the symptoms of autism (as in Fragile X syndrome for example, where autistic symptoms are common but not universal), but, in the cases where the individual does have autism, the evidence that the specific mutation is causing those symptoms is extremely strong (i.e., the most reasonable and probable inference is that if they did not have the mutation they would not have autism).   </p>
<p>In contrast, previous associations with common SNPs, which supposedly contribute only a tiny increase in risk alone but a large effect in aggregate, have not held up over time.  In my opinion, that is because that model of the genetic architecture of illness is not correct &#8211; that does not imply (at all) that the illness is not primarily genetic.</p>
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		<title>Comment on De novo mutations in autism by DR01D</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/04/04/de-novo-mutations-in-autism/#comment-2903</link>
		<dc:creator>DR01D</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Apr 2012 14:09:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1469#comment-2903</guid>
		<description>kjmtchl

&quot;We identified POTENTIALLY causative de novo events in 4 out of 20 probands, particularly among more severely affected individuals, in FOXP1, GRIN2B, SCN1A and LAMC3.&quot;

You wrote that these 4 mutations cause Autism and yet the study abstract says that they are &quot;potentially causitive&quot;.

Over the last 20 years the only common denominator I&#039;ve seen in the field of genetics is oversold findings.

While it&#039;s certainly possible that these 4 genes trigger Autism I wouldn&#039;t bet on it.  If history is any guide future research will suggest that they are merely associated with an increased risk of disease or the original discovery was a false positive.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>kjmtchl</p>
<p>&#8220;We identified POTENTIALLY causative de novo events in 4 out of 20 probands, particularly among more severely affected individuals, in FOXP1, GRIN2B, SCN1A and LAMC3.&#8221;</p>
<p>You wrote that these 4 mutations cause Autism and yet the study abstract says that they are &#8220;potentially causitive&#8221;.</p>
<p>Over the last 20 years the only common denominator I&#8217;ve seen in the field of genetics is oversold findings.</p>
<p>While it&#8217;s certainly possible that these 4 genes trigger Autism I wouldn&#8217;t bet on it.  If history is any guide future research will suggest that they are merely associated with an increased risk of disease or the original discovery was a false positive.</p>
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		<title>Comment on De novo mutations in autism by kjmtchl</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/04/04/de-novo-mutations-in-autism/#comment-2902</link>
		<dc:creator>kjmtchl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Apr 2012 07:33:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1469#comment-2902</guid>
		<description>DR01D: &quot;Research that looks for correlations between heredity and illness becomes less impressive by the day&quot;???  How a report on the discovery of four new genes in which mutations cause autism leads you to that conclusion is baffling.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>DR01D: &#8220;Research that looks for correlations between heredity and illness becomes less impressive by the day&#8221;???  How a report on the discovery of four new genes in which mutations cause autism leads you to that conclusion is baffling.</p>
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		<title>Comment on De novo mutations in autism by DR01D</title>
		<link>http://www.gnxp.com/wp/2012/04/04/de-novo-mutations-in-autism/#comment-2901</link>
		<dc:creator>DR01D</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Apr 2012 05:52:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gnxp.com/wp/?p=1469#comment-2901</guid>
		<description>Mark Houston

I&#039;m sure if you asked the studies authors they would tell you that the connection between obesity and Autism is in some way related to harmful inflammation or a secondary consequence of harmful inflammation.

The next time you read that a disease is associated with obesity think associated with inflammation.  The two are connected like pepperoni and cheese.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark Houston</p>
<p>I&#8217;m sure if you asked the studies authors they would tell you that the connection between obesity and Autism is in some way related to harmful inflammation or a secondary consequence of harmful inflammation.</p>
<p>The next time you read that a disease is associated with obesity think associated with inflammation.  The two are connected like pepperoni and cheese.</p>
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